[vinny]

hello all every since i have had my cougar i have constantly had problems with starter motor and flexplate ..i have replaced 3 to 4 starters and on my second flexplate. looking back at it i think it is one of two things either the universal bell housing i was using was crap or the metal plate that goes between engine and flexplate which i did take out a long time ago may have caused this. i will be getting a third new flexplate and a new bell housing but i would really like this to be my last time EVER having to deal with this so i would like some suggestions from you guys.
1. i have never had the metal plate installed that goes between flexplate and motor. could not having this in have caused me to damage 4 starters and go through 3 flexplates what purpose does it serve besides a heat shield...does it help keep the starter in place.
2. iwould like some suggestions on bellhousings that different people are using the one i have came from performanceautomatic and i honestly hate that thing i have had to pull it and get it sent to a machine shop so many times and i am sick of it.
3. the starter i am using is an oreilly starter and they are not lasting long seems like the teeth on the starter are wearing down and then it starts making a horrible noise. so what are some suggestions on starters.
for obvious reasons i really never want to have to go through this again it is to expensive and time consuming so i would like to gather all the info i can from you guys that will offer it. thanks ps if i have left anything out please letg me know and i will porvide the info thanks again

 

[Old man]

Vinny,

I have a 1967, 289, C-4 that I had no history on when I bought it, so no idea what parts were original or even correct. I had a similiar problem with starter & flexplate. I do have the spacer plate on my car. After burning up one starter and tearing up two flexplates I discovered the following; The starter I bought from NAPA, while it seemed to fit properly, left the starter gear extremely close to the flexplate. At the NAPA store we compared several starters, all with the same part # and even the same part # on the aluminum casting that forms the endbell on the starter drive end. The difference we found was that on the one that was tearing up my flexplate, this casting was flat, while on another it was made concave. The one made concave allowed the bendix to withdrawl further from the flexplate when disengaged. Since installing this starter I've had no problems. Others had suggested shimming the starter. That may work, but I now believe it's more a matter of finding the right starter. Hope this helps.

 

[vinny]

this sounds promising and may save me allot of time and money but ok so napa is one ...i agree with starter too but what are some other places what is everybody using what about autozone or advance auto or even pepboys where has everybody got there starters...also when you say concave do you mean kinda curved and are you talking about the metal piece of the starter that goes into the bell housing..............come to think about it it really could be the starter again my bolts in bell housing seem like they are holding tight depending on which starter i have got in the past sometimes a shim was needed with this current one it was not...my current starter sounded good for 2 days then it started making that horrible noise i checked the bolts and it was tight wtf could not believe it one thing i know it wont be oreilly for my next starter

 

[Old man]

Vinny,

I don't think it matters where you buy the starter, they're all rebuilt. One of mine had an "AMC" stamped in the main housing and a totally different P/N. I guess the original manufacturer made them for several companies. The starter housing is made of a heavy metal frame that holds the coils with a flat plate on the front that holds the brushes and a cast aluminum rear end housing that supports the bendix drive, I'm refering to this aluminum piece. On the one that did not work in my 67, if you pulled the starter gear out as if it was engaging the flexplate you could see that the portion of the aluminum housing between the starter gear and the rotor had a flat surface that the drive sat against at rest. On this starter, the drive gear was just barely clear of the flexplate when not engaged, any slight sticking or hesistation would allow the drive to stick in the flexplate. On the one I have now (from NAPA) this portion of the housing is concave, which allows the drive to retract about 1/4" further into the starter & away from the flexplate. I pointed this out to the NAPA counterman & we found that both parts, although different in design, carried the same Ford P/N. I am guessing that this indicates different vintage or application of the starter & that nobody is paying any attention to it. All I know is I found a difference that seemed to be a potential cause for the problem, and since changing the starter I've had no more problems.

 

[vinny]

well i never tried napa before and seeing as it worked for you i will give it a try what about bell housing and flexplate where did you get yours

 

[vinny]

bump come on guys i know it is the second day after thankgiving and we all ate allot but lol can anybody else ad to this thanks

 

[Bad69cat]

Vinny you still battling that thing! WTF Guss! I thought you had that cat by the tail by now. Did you try the lipstick trick to see where this thing is truely enguaging the flexplate? They do make starter shims for Ford 2 bolt starters to space them out if needed. Try spacing it out to where it still catches the flexplate entirely but yet has good clearance @ about 1/4"

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/DOR3/02359.oap?ck=Search_N0277_DOR_-1_-1&mn=Dorman&mc=DOR&pt=N0277&ppt=C0330

 

[vinny]

Vinny you still battling that thing! WTF Guss! I thought you had that cat by the tail by now. Did you try the lipstick trick to see where this thing is truely enguaging the flexplate? They do make starter shims for Ford 2 bolt starters to space them out if needed. Try spacing it out to where it still catches the flexplate entirely but yet has good clearance @ about 1/4"

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/DOR3/02359.oap?ck=Search_N0277_DOR_-1_-1&mn=Dorman&mc=DOR&pt=N0277&ppt=C0330

lol bad09cat funny thing is out of the four starters i went through two required that shim two did not the last one from oreilly worked well without it but only lasted 2 days the bolts were tight as well going to take it off to see if something is wrong with starter i bought another starter from pep boys yesterday i am going to put them side by side to see if there is any difference i am really sick of this

 

[Old man]

Vinny,

One other thing to check; Is the starter staying engaged due to a bad ignition switch? Interesting that you're eating up starter gears, my problem was starter gear eating up flexplates. Anybody else out there have any thoughts?

 

[vinny]

ok this morning went to autozone and bought 2 universal starter motor bolts and replaced them with old ones (kept original starter in) one thing i noticed immediately was that the starter sat a little different tightened bolts and started car(did not give it gas ..did not want it to start) it turned over ok it sounded allot better but i did not get too excited yet remeber i have been here before. got under it with a flash light to see how close starter gear was to flexplate ...good thing i did...it seems that the new starter bolts are pulling the starter closer in the gears are engaging and sticking out even further past flywheel on the inside. it seems that the gears are so close that the flexplate is not allowing the gear to retract back. this is exactly what old man had mentioned earlier,..but this was not happening before. i thanked myself that the car did not start with this problem because there could have been a bigger problem. this afternoon i will go back out there and put the shim back on the starter to help push it out and to give the starter more chance of being able to pull back in. ok so once i have the shim on and i try to start it without giving it gas once i let of the key the starter motor should pull itself back in free and clear of starter correct.......seems as if my problem these last few years may have just been the wrong starter bolts but time will tell

 

[Bad69cat]

Currious to see what you figure out --- you may want to lay under there while the thing is cranking and watch the flexplate as it turns to see if it's not warped somehow? Starting to get suspicious....