[modifiedmark]

I must be getting crazy, but I have been thinking that I would maybe in the future like to have a pro street style Cougar.

I would like to do a mustang II front suspension under one and dont feel like cutting mine up to do so. I would like to do a project with one and would like to find some info on back halving the car also. The mustang II front end would allow the spring towers to be removed and leave plenty of room for a big block, and also improve the steering.

If going that far I like the look of the narrowed rear and really big rear tires, but I'm not really that familiar with them. I have done many rear frames on my stock cars and would not be afraid of doing the work myself, but advice on mesurements and such would be helpfull.

If I were to do a project like this I would probably have to sell my present Cougar ( the wife still wants a ragtop and would have a hard time keeping it and another Cougar also) and I would like to keep the back seat and dont want to roll bar it, but I dont think its possible is it?? Maybe some smaller tubs? Give me your opinions please.

Anyone know of any links to such info?? :1poke: mm

 

[Cougrrcj]

Show or Go?

You don't have to back-half the car to get it to go fast. My one bud is running a 71 Mach 1 with a full interior - including the back seat - and is running 10.60s in the quarter. He had to do a little juggling with wheel spacing to fit a 11" slick back there in the stock wheelwells, but he's getting more than enough traction like that. Of course, a 514ci stroker motor helps a lot, too! He's still running a full-length rear end, but went to a ladder bar and coilover rear suspension.

He customized the roll cage by making a few slight bends here and there so that he can still have his stock deluxe door panels and such.

His car leaves so hard people swear that he's using a trans brake - neat trick since there is no such animal for a FMX trans! He's bent a couple rear suspension components and has gusseted them now to prevent a reoccurance of that sort of thing. He's also snapped an aftermarket 35-spline rear axle! Now that's power!

All he has to do to make this car street legal is to bolt on a set of street tires and hook up the exhaust. The exhaust is still under the car since it would look silly with the cutout valence panel without the requisite chrome tips. In fact, he has driven the car to the dealership where he works to get a frontend alingment.

Now, ya gotta ask yourself one question. Do you want show or do you want go!?!

 

[bowl]

or not street legal

here is an old idea. i bet those fiberglass bodies are out of production. or are they?

 

[wvcat]

A while back there was a project pro street 69 cougar on ebay. Bruce from the yahoo groups list bought it but hasn't started finnishing it yet. He is away right now but he would probably take some pictures for you when he gets back. He shows up sometimes on the chat thursday nights.
John
wvcat

 

[modifiedmark]

CJ, I know where your coming from but I'm talking mostly the look, not a full bore racer. Thats why I would want to keep the back seat because it would be a driver, but it would definatly be no slouch. Got to keep a place for the kiddies to drive you nuts. But I do love the pro street look. I'm thinking mostly stock outer appearence, maybe eliminator stripes, scoops and spoilers. But you know the stance I'm talking with the fat ones tucked up under the rear and the skinnies up front. I'm not saying its definatly in my future, just mulling over the possiabilitys and doing some research.

John,I think I remember the car on e-bay your talking about, and it would be a bit too radical for my plans. If I remember that rear was really too narrow and definatly no back seat. Besides I think it was caged if I remember right. mm

 

[clevelandcougar]

What you need to do when the kids start bugging ya is have enough power so when you stomp on the gas the kids get pushed so far back in their seats that they dissappear. HeHeHe

 

[70 Blue Cat]

Hello mm
Just thought i would say hi and let you know cougars look good pro street. There is a white 70 here in town, started out as a nice 351 C , then the guy had a dumb __ attack and he put a chevy motor in it. If i talk to him i will try to get some measurements and pics of the car.
Jerry

 

[modifiedmark]

Thanks Jerry, pics would be appreciated. I thought by now some of the youngsters from the left coast would have chirpped up with some info. I'm not very efficent with internet searches and figured someone(much better than me) would have come up with a site with some info. mm

 

[Cougrrcj]

Cross breeding

My buddy Carl really liked the oddball and offbeat stuff.

He had inherited his grandfather's 70 Custom 500. For the ones too young to remember, the full size Fords of that era came in a Custom, the Galaxie, then the LTD, the Custom being the cheap line. Anyway, Carl's Custom had a high compression 429-2V and C-6. It also came with a broken frame due to rust - that was very common on the 69-70 cars. So he had yanked the engine and trans out of the Custom and had it laying around under his workbench.

He wanted more ooomph in his 305 Camaro, and got tired of having problems with the Chevy rat motor he was trying to use. He took a look around the garage and inspiration (craziness?) hit him. Why not drop that 429 into the Camaro? It really wasn't as hard as one would think! Just drill another set of holes for the engine mount, use a rear sump oil pan from some other Ford product, an aftermarket floor shifter and voila! Loads more fun than your basic small block!

I tried to talk him into leaving it in there long enough (and having the jutspah) to drive it into the big Performance Ford Club of America all-Ford show at Ricart Ford in Columbus. They would refuse entry to anything that wasn't Ford powered, like chevy-powered roadsters and such. I thought we would run this one by 'em, just to see what their reaction was! Carl chickened out. Still would have been fun though!

 

[rick68]

Mark,

I've been mulling this over too with my 68 Standard. It doesn't have any options at all so it wouldn't be a great loss to the original Cougar population to cut it up. I've got a 550hp engine going in it so I will definitely need some traction but I just can't bring myself to cut it up.

I looked at all the options and can tell you what I found. With the wheel tubs like your talking about, you would have to cut from the torque boxes back to the rear of the trunk out and get a rear subframe welded in. Morrison Engineering makes a complete subframe with either ladder bar or 4 link suspension, coil over shocks, panhard bar and a 9" rearend housing for $1565 (ladder bar) and $1885 (4-Link) for the complete kit. They recommend a roll bar with the 2"x 3" boxed frame or you can get the 2"x 4" boxed frame that doesn't require one but it's heavier. There will be no back seat should you decide to go this way.

The other option would be mini-tubs. I've seen some articles and talked to people who've done this. It's not easy but it looks really good and has a stock appearance if done properly. You start by cutting the rear wheel wells out. Then you take a long strip of sheetmetal 2"-3" wide and weld it between the two halves, thereby making it a "mini-tub." Then comes the real hard part. You can weld part of it flush to your frame but if you look, the frame doesn't run straight to the rear of the car. It curves out as it travels to the rear of the car so you have to notch the frame and recess the mini-tub into the frame. It's not a job for a beginner but the results appear stock, get a bigger tire under it, and you get to keep the back seat. In either case you would want sub-frame connectors.

What I want to know and maybe Cougrrcj can help me with this. I want to leave the car uncut but install a ladder bar/coil over suspension instead of the old leaf spring setup. Do you have a picture of your friends Mach 1 rear suspension? I'd like to see how he did it. Also, if anyone knows anything about this, I could use some advice.

One more thing then I'll shut up. I couldn't believe it when I saw the photo that "bowl" posted of the old Cougar funny car. I was riding around on the backroads around my house here in hot and humid Hiram, Georgia when I saw a Cougar funny car body on a dolly behind a guys house. The rear looked like it was a 67/68 but I'm not sure. I'm going to stop by soon and take some pictures. I'm new to the board but I'll try and post them as well as some of my car.

P.S. Dark, sorry it took so long to respond to you. I've been trying to send you a reply from my computer at work and it kept saying I wasn't specifying a thread or forum or something. In any case, what I want to do is detailed above if your friend knows anything about this swap. Thanks for the reply.

 

[clevelandcougar]

My friend had told me about some Ford powered Camaro he found on some camaro board the internet. He is a devout chevy owner, he moaned and complained something about some grave injustice done to chevys every where for about a week, the whole time I kept telling him about how there was finally a chevy owner with some common sense.

Sorry about expanding on the off subject topic.
Anyway...
I saw a prosteet style '67/'68 (can't remember which) that was on ebay not to long ago, it was purple, and had a blown cleveland, maybe someone else remembers this also.

 

[modifiedmark]

Rick, I have a morrison catalog and those back stubs are not what I'm looking for, definatly not for a back seat because they mount so far forward for the extra long ladder bars.

I also am not leaning in the direction of a link suspension, I have plenty of experiance with them from stock cars and know there not very durable for a car that is driven often. Those heim joints don't last very long and get expensive fast. I have spent my share on them in the past.

I realize about having to remove the rear torque boxes and plan on having to fabricate my own. I figure that maybe staying with leaf springs I could start new rear rails up from the stock forward location. (so the back seat could be saved) I also figured that if properly constructed they could be made from 2x2 altough 2x3 would probably be ok. I know that 2x4 would be overkill for this project.

I was figureing maybe a 13" to 14" tire would work and maybe save the outer stock wheel houses and just fabricate new inners to them maybe 6" wider and maybe getting away with narrowing the back seat some after some mods to the inner rear quarter trims. Mind you I havent got into exact mesurements yet, just some rough guessing.

Morrison eng did have one item that caught my eye and that was a set of "sliders" to mount a set of ladder bars to leaf springs that allow the springs to move without binding on the springs. I was also thinking this setup would work as well with a mono leaf / coil and shock setup.

I am getting really caught up with this idea and plan to keep looking into it. I know a guy who I used to live by that is really into the pro street stuff and has done several cars and trucks, and when I get time I'm going to talk to him about it for suggestions.

I would like to use my Cougar for couple months and I MAY decide to put it up for sale in like mid july and see what happens. The hard part would be finding the right car for the project, but it might not be as hard as I think because you wouldnt care if it needed floor and trunk pans or if the shock towers were rusted out or not. Basically a 69 standard with a good straight outer body with good trim and a halfway decent int. Motor or no motor.

Cleavlandcougar that purple blown Cougar must still be for sale as the other day while searching for info on the seach engines I kept coming acrossed it. Its a nice car allright but not exactly what I'm looking to do. mm

 

[blksn8k]

I have a similar project except my car is a 67 Ranchero. At least I don't have to worry about a back seat! I am using Jeg's S/S bars with HAL coilovers in the rear and 31x16.5 MT's on 15x12 Weld Prostars. The rear axle is a narrowed half ton pickup 9 inch with a nodular carrier and 3.89 Richmond gears and Moser 31 spline axles. I have already installed 2x4 frame rails. I figured since this is sort of a truck the extra beef won't hurt. I am planning on installing a Mustang II front suspension. I have most of the parts for that with the exception of the crossmember and some other bits and pieces. I was planning on buying the crossmember from R.C. Motorsports in South Carolina. You guys reminded me that I need to call them to see if they will bring one to the All Ford Nats in Carlisle. I have a fairly mild .030 over 460 and a C6 ready to go in. The car needed new floors and some firewall work when I bought it. I have fixed all that and am at the point where I need to install the rear suspension. According to the VIN it was a 390 4-speed car with a bench seat but had a 289/C4 combo in it when I got it. If it had the original drivetrain and if it had a better body I might not have gone this route but I think this will be worth the effort.
I added a link to a pic which is actually a snapshot from an Autocad 3D model I did of the rear suspension. I wanted to get an accurate layout of the attachment points so I figured why not use my drafting background? If you check the rest of that album you will see a couple more Autocad snapshots as well as some pics of one frame rail installed. Oh yeah, check out the teardrop hood! I have a complete 'glass frontclip from Crites Restorations.

http://communities.msn.com/blksn8kphotos/rancheropics.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=114

 

[modifiedmark]

blksn8k, Looks like a nice project. I like the big block and would be considering the same , or a BIG small block and maybe a AOD. If you get a chance I would like to know the mesurements on the rear axle with, axle flange to axle flange including the brake drums or rotors, along with the wheel backspacing and overall with from tire outside to outside, not tread to tread. Also if you have a link or # for R.C Motorsports I would appreciate it.mm

 

[ronzoni]

My 68 standard has the back seat for my two boys still. BUT, it also has a ladder bar setup with the original (but recently replaced "stock") leafsprings. 9" rearend, with drag shocks and the like on a mount that goes up into the well a ways, not the old original "angled" units. It also has a rollbar, but a modest, not too intrusive 4 point affair. Coupled with the subframe connectors, they add LOTS of stiffness to the car. I have a set of 9" slicks for the strip on a custom offset set of steel wheels, so they don't have the "tubbed and narrowed" look you may be after, but once those slicks are warm, they won't break loose! My car has around 400hp 302, so not a real stump puller, and it WON'T compete with the 9 to 10 second crowd at the strip anymore, but I sure like the whole "aura" of that big ole' pumpkin and the extra "accessories". I'll take some pics since it's still up on jack stands with the trans on the workbench.

Ron.

 

[modifiedmark]

Ron please do, I would like to see how the ladder bar setup is working with the leafs. mm

 

[rick68]

Yeah Ron,

I want to see what you've done, sounds like something I might want to try.

Like the Ranchero too!

 

[blksn8k]

mm, the axle width is 55 1/2" drum to drum. I realize that is a little wide for this sort of project but the price was right and I was able to pick up the Weld wheels with the correct backspacing for a good price as well. The wheels are 15x12 with 6 1/2" backspacing. I paid $400 for the complete axle assembly including the axles, drums, nodular center section and stock traction lock diff. The only thing I had to buy was the ring and pinion gears. It was also narrowed by Moser. The wheels w/tires cost me $300 at a swap meet. Needless to say, this project has been on a budget! The width across outside tire sidewalls is 69 5/8". One advantage of an axle this wide is that I have lots of room to mount the brackets for the S/S bars and shocks. Also, the width should help with vehicle stability since this is a street car. The big disadvantage, of course, is I hope I never get a flat! With the shape of the wheelwells I will need to disconnect the shocks and let the axle drop in order to remove the tires. But, how often do you replace a tire on something like this? I have to believe most Pro-street type cars have a similar problem.
Oh, almost forgot, here is the link to R.C. Motorsports. You cannot order parts via the net but their phone number is on the website. They do have an on-line catalog. Check it out.

http://www.rcmotorsports.net/page2.html

 

[modifiedmark]

blksn8k, Thanks alot for the measurements, they sound very close to what I had figured. The tire you piced out is the same size I was kinda figuring on using as I dont want to go any taller.

I hear you on changing a flat, and the leaf spring set up I was thinking about would be even more trouble to deal with, but it wouldnt be the end of the world to have to drop the rear shackles.

That total with would be very close to what I was figuring would work and I also agree with the widest rear possiable with a shallow backset wheel.

I was also wondering about fabbing up a rear swaybar on it to help with the rear stability?? Thanks again.mm

 

[ronzoni]

This thread seemed like it's approaching max-gross takoff weight, so I started a new one by the title "pro street back halves cont'd" to put the pics of my rearend/spring setup in.

Ron.