[nymorey]

I have been futzing with my edelbog (pun intended) for 2 years now. When I stomp on it from a dead stop it seriously bogs to the point of sometimes stalling. Other than that it runs great.
I have messed with the jets, rods, acc pump, timing, and vacuum. I have talked with their tech support and bought just about every rod/jet combo they have.
Everytime I think I have it licked, it seems to work for a while then it does it again.

I'm done..........going to change to a holley next spring

 

[Cougrrcj]

Give us (or remind us) of your engine's/trans/rear gearing particulars and we can help you make the right decision!

FWIW, I could never get the Motorcraft 4300 in either of my '73s to work worth a darn. Once I put the Holley '66 GT390 carb on BetaCat, it was a different animal!!!

I now have a Holley 670 Street Avenger on my '89 Crown Vic's 460hp 393W. Love it!!!!

 

[1970fastcat]

Either way, I would say go with a Holley, but have you checked the advance curve? What dizzy are you running?

 

[liteaqua67]

I bolted an Edelbrock on my wife's 69 351w and havent regretted a single minute of it.
Have you checked the fuel pressure right at the carb?? I was having problems at one point and it turned out to be a weak fuel pump. It was barely putting 4psi out at the carb. Once the fuel pump was changed it ran great again.
I'm not trying to defend the Edelbrock, just trying to save you from spending a lot of money that you may not have to.

 

[woodsnake]

Most carb problems are misdiagnosed ignition problems...Have you looked at all your wiring, etc??

 

[Seafoam jcode]

I have been futzing with my edelbog (pun intended) for 2 years now. When I stomp on it from a dead stop it seriously bogs to the point of sometimes stalling. Other than that it runs great.
I have messed with the jets, rods, acc pump, timing, and vacuum. I have talked with their tech support and bought just about every rod/jet combo they have.
Everytime I think I have it licked, it seems to work for a while then it does it again.

I'm done..........going to change to a holley next spring

I went through exactly the same thing you did with the Carter AFB. Made elaborate tables with the cross sectional areas of all the metering rods and metering jet combinations to try to get the perfect mixture for both idle and driving. I was always told the the main metering circuit should have no affect on the idle circuit since the idle mixture screws are downstream of the main metering jets. But, I could never get it lean enough at idle to run smoothly and NOT burn my eyes with rich exhaust. If I went to a leaner rod and jet combo, it would run smooth and not burn my eyes after adjusting the idle mixture screws. But it seemed to lose power once out of the idle circuit. I finally gave up, put the Holley back on and was able to lean it out at idle with no overly rich exhaust AND have the power I expected during normal driving.

The Holley has way more adjustability for your bog problem with different shooter sizes and pump cams.

 

[nymorey]

Give us (or remind us) of your engine's/trans/rear gearing particulars and we can help you make the right decision!

351W, AFR 185 heads, this CAM http://www.compcams.com/Company/CC/cam-specs/Details.aspx?csid=897&sb=0,stock crank, .30 over, 3.50 rear posi, 2500 stall behind a rebuilt C-4.

Either way, I would say go with a Holley, but have you checked the advance curve? What dizzy are you running?

Yes, I have a MSD dizzy and 6al box. I'm using the lightest spring to get my timing advanced quickly. I'm at 18 BDTC at 900 rpm idle in park. 38 degrees total advance

Most carb problems are misdiagnosed ignition problems...Have you looked at all your wiring, etc??

Yes, completely rewired, checked and adjustyed. Remember it works fine EXCEPT when I mash the pedal. If I accelerate fast it is fine, just when I mash the pedal. Sort of un-manly when you go to lay a strip of rubber and your car stalls or sputters!:realmad:

 

[mopardon]

Your secondaries may be opening to early. On a Holley you can just change spring...On a Carter I,m not sure how you adjust it.

 

[nymorey]

Give us (or remind us) of your engine's/trans/rear gearing particulars and we can help you make the right decision!

FWIW, I could never get the Motorcraft 4300 in either of my '73s to work worth a darn. Once I put the Holley '66 GT390 carb on BetaCat, it was a different animal!!!

I now have a Holley 670 Street Avenger on my '89 Crown Vic's 460hp 393W. Love it!!!!

Either way, I would say go with a Holley, but have you checked the advance curve? What dizzy are you running?

Most carb problems are misdiagnosed ignition problems...Have you looked at all your wiring, etc??

Your secondaries may be opening to early. On a Holley you can just change spring...On a Carter I,m not sure how you adjust it.

You can't change the opening of the secondaries on the edelbrock. The 1806 has an air valve that you can adjust the opening pressure. I have talked with edelbrock and tightened it as much as they recommend.

 

[Bad69cat]

Ray, you know anybody you could borrow one from just for a test? It still may or may not be carb related. Sounds like either lack of fuel/to much fuel, or advance lacking. I feel your pain. I'm running a 4160 and have the same cam you do - it runs best when it's cool, but i still have a bit of hesitation if I really hammer it. I will have to check which spring combo I have, I think it's a mix of the lightest and the next heavier one....it helped playing with these and timing. I'm pretty sure I'm over jetted a bit, since this carb was running excellent on a much higher HP motor. I need to order the adjusta jet kit and get it put in. I think that is the way to go, I just haven't had time. Everybody from the racing circles swears by them though.

 

[xr7g428]

Ray, Have you tried increasing initial advance to see if it has any effect? I was tuning on a Chevy with a pretty radical cam and the only way we got the bog out at the bottom end was to run the idle speed up to about 1000 rpm and to run manifold vacuum to the vac advance PLUS about 15 degrees of base advance. At idle it would show something like 30 degrees of total advance, and only about 13 inches of vacuum.

 

[nymorey]

Ray, Have you tried increasing initial advance to see if it has any effect? I was tuning on a Chevy with a pretty radical cam and the only way we got the bog out at the bottom end was to run the idle speed up to about 1000 rpm and to run manifold vacuum to the vac advance PLUS about 15 degrees of base advance. At idle it would show something like 30 degrees of total advance, and only about 13 inches of vacuum.

That's pretty radical advance! Do you have problems starting it?

I run at 18 deg advance at 900 rpm in park, when I'm in drive the rpm drops to 700. My vacuum is only about 10" in at idle and about 6" in drive. I might go a little more but I'm not interested in going that radical.

Badcat, I don't have a holley to try.

 

[xr7g428]

Actually it runs great. It is in a K5 Blazer and he really screwed up building a big HP motor that makes no low end torque. It was a much better 4x4 when it was stock. The vacuum advance running off manifold vacuum is what makes the advance so high at idle. Does your distributor have vacuum advance?

 

[nymorey]

Actually it runs great. It is in a K5 Blazer and he really screwed up building a big HP motor that makes no low end torque. It was a much better 4x4 when it was stock. The vacuum advance running off manifold vacuum is what makes the advance so high at idle. Does your distributor have vacuum advance?

Yes it does have vacuum advance. I tried running off the mainfold vacuum (vs the ported) but I didn't see any change.
When you mash the pedal, vacuum drops to zero anyway so your not seeing any vacuum advance, which is why I thought I saw no change.
My advance is at 38 deg by 2000 rpm so it advances pretty quick.

 

[clanceman427]

been a while since I messed with the Edelbrocks, so remind me- is there any adjustability on the accelerator pump circuit? as someone mentioned already, the holleys have adjustment on the rate and volume of fuel coming in on the accelerator pump(s) which to me sounds like where you need tuning. The accelerator pump circuit provides that instant shot that is necessary to cover that quick transition between the idle circuit and the main power circuit, since it can't react quickly enough on it's own. The trick is figuring out if your pump shot is too much too fast, or not enough too slow, or somewhere in between. automatic trans i assume? if so i'd recommend vaccum secondary holley.

if you decide to try a holley and don't want to buy new, check out Racingjunk.com. I built my race motor with a lot of stuff bought/sold on that site, and it's free.

Kevin

 

[clanceman427]

another area of improvement (albeit a lot more work and expense to swap this) would be your torque converter. I just checked out your cam, maybe you could use some more stall, like 3000 or a smidge more. your rear gear seems a bit out of the range (they call for at least 3:73), plus depending on the torque your engine makes, and when, coupled with a relatively heavy car, this might unlock some more of that instantaneous "mash the throttle" response, depending on when that converter flashes (real world stall speed WITHOUT power braking it).

i assume you already have a trans cooler with the 2500 converter (if not get one). Just as a for instance, I ran a 3000 stall speed converter with a 4:11 gear and a comp cams 280 magnum cam in a slightly bigger motor (406) in a heavy impala and the street manners were still fine (if you're concerned about overheating or mileage with more stall)

Kevin

 

[cougarshaman]

I agree with Clanceman and others.
Sounds like the converter is too tight and maybe the timing isn't advancing properly with the acceleration curve of the engine.

It's also possible you don't have sufficient vacuum for the volume of fuel to remain in suspension with atmosphere at off idle engine speeds, especially if you are dropping the hammer with only 9 or so inches at idle. You're literally shooting a mass of fuel into the intake and then don't have enough atmosphere moving through to keep it in suspension without a nozzle to disperse it.

I'm curious if you are using a spacer under the carb, if it pops when it bogs or if it just bogs and then catches, etc.

However, I remember you've been feeling like the Edelbrock was a mistake for quite a while.
Buy yourself a Holley, wrap the Edelbrock up in a USPS box, and send it to me for Christmas!

Seriously, as hardcore as your engine is, you should just go ahead and get a Holley so you can squeeze every pony out of it. I like Edelbrock carbs. You know I do. I also like Holley and think that your engine is so performance oriented that you should just have one on it for no other reason than "just cause."

Then, you'll see if the problem can be tuned out via the carb.

 

[xr7g428]

If a little more advance doesn't do the trick you have to look at fuel next. This is where a good Holley double pumper can't be beat.

 

[nymorey]

been a while since I messed with the Edelbrocks, so remind me- is there any adjustability on the accelerator pump circuit? as someone mentioned already, the holleys have adjustment on the rate and volume of fuel coming in on the accelerator pump(s) which to me sounds like where you need tuning. The accelerator pump circuit provides that instant shot that is necessary to cover that quick transition between the idle circuit and the main power circuit, since it can't react quickly enough on it's own. The trick is figuring out if your pump shot is too much too fast, or not enough too slow, or somewhere in between. automatic trans i assume? if so i'd recommend vaccum secondary holley.

if you decide to try a holley and don't want to buy new, check out Racingjunk.com. I built my race motor with a lot of stuff bought/sold on that site, and it's free.

Kevin

The edelbrock has 3 settings for the accelerator pump volume. Changing the stroke changes the volume. You can replace the nozzles to change the rate.
I have played with both. Right now I have max volume and rate.

 

[nymorey]

I agree with Clanceman and others.
I'm curious if you are using a spacer under the carb, if it pops when it bogs or if it just bogs and then catches, etc.
Buy yourself a Holley, wrap the Edelbrock up in a USPS box, and send it to me for Christmas

I have a 1/2" spacer under the carb. When I stomp on it, sometimes it stalls, other times it sputters but never catchs, other times it bogs then catches. When I'm cruising and stomp on it, it hesitates for a second then catches and goes like the dickens. No popping. At one point it was backfiring through the carb but I fixed that issue a while ago and haven;t had anymore problems.

Send me your address!